It’s no exaggeration to say that comic creator Phillip Kennedy Johnson is one of the most acclaimed and popular writers in the industry at the moment. Among his many career highlights in recent years is his integral role in helping to revitalizing Superman and the Super Family with the epic “Warworld Saga,” a storyline that saw the Man of Steel travel to the eponymous slave planet to overthrow the tyrant Mongul and free its enslaved denizens. With the Adventures of Superman: Book of El limited series, Kennedy will not only be closing a chapter with the Superman character but also with DC publishing now that the prolific creator has signed a multi-year exclusive contract with Marvel.
The Beat recently had the pleasure of chatting with Johnson to discuss the decision behind signing the exclusive contract. In addition, he also what writing Superman has meant to him personally and professionally and teased upcoming projects.
The interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Taimur Dar: I only recently discovered that prior to breaking into comics you were an army veteran and a trumpet player in the U.S. Army Field Band. It’s always fascinating to see often people’s careers and lives are rarely a straight line. Was becoming a comics creator always a goal for you?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: I loved comics as a kid and was looking for a creative outlet. But no, I wasn’t thinking about comics as a career at all. I had a younger brother who was an artist. He wanted to do comics as an illustrator but had no idea how to get in. He was living in darkest Kentucky where I was from. No internet and an hour from the closest shop. He didn’t know anything about comics. He just liked to draw. He was going to community college and doing okay but not loving it. I felt for him and [said], “Come move out with me and we’ll figure it out.” I missed creative writing and hadn’t done it in a long time. By that point I was playing trumpet in one of the military bands in the capitol. We literally bought a “How to Make Comics for Dummies” book and just educated ourselves together.
When I was making books with him, I would just write short stories or poems for him to illustrate to give him sequential pages. He was just drawing pinups and picture of Wolverine looking cool. But he wasn’t drawing pictures that told a story. It was fun for me to learn a new art form and it gave him something to draw that was a portfolio. As I got the bug, I started looking for other artists to work with. I wasn’t really thinking about making money doing it because I already had a job. I just loved it. But it worked out. I put together some pitch packets with various other artists and those got noticed by DC and Marvel.
Taimur Dar: There is definitely a purity in the creative process when you don’t have to worry about financial success. Since you already had a full-time job, did you feel less pressure when you started making your way into the comics industry?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: It was nice not to worry or have to think if something was going to sell or not. I was just writing stories I thought were powerful and important and I could make the thing I wanted to read that I was super proud of. When the idea for my first printed book [Last Sons of America] came together, it was 2010 and there was a big earthquake in Haiti. It became this big humanitarian crisis. A lot of families were having a hard time finding each other. This American mission group went down to Haiti ostensibly to help rescue orphans, but they ended up smuggling out kids who still had families to get them to the states to be raised by Christians. I was already doing some anti-human trafficking work at the time. I didn’t know anything about the for-profit adoption industry at all and the dark sides to it. It sent me down this rabbit hole. This story came together in my mind of a world in which Americans can’t have kids anymore and it makes human trafficking legit.
At the time, my wife and I had struggled to get pregnant. All these different things that were in my mind percolated and became this new thing; a story about brothers, pregnancy issues, human trafficking, the dark side of the adoption industry. I could just tell a story that was beating its way out of my rib cage that just had to be told. I wasn’t thinking about the demographics or what’s hot right now. I did it and found a great artist. It was purely for the love of the game. That’s what I love most about comics. You don’t find people that are in it to be the next multimillionaire Steven Spielberg of comics. Everyone is so purely themselves. I love the comics community a lot and it’s an honor to be a part of it.
Taimur Dar: It’s no exaggeration to say that Superman is having a renaissance thanks to the new James Gunn movie. But in the years leading up to the movie, the character has definitely been revitalized in the comics such as your acclaimed work such as the epic “Warworld Saga” storyline. What has writing Superman meant to you?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: It’s the honor of a lifetime. I never thought I’d get a chance like that. When Jamie Rich came to me and asked me to take over the Superman and Action Comics titles after [Brian Michael] Bendis stepped away I said, “I think you got the wrong number.” I had just pitched a Red Hood heist miniseries book. I saw myself as a street level kind of guy. But I had also recently done The Last God: Book I of the Fellspyre Chronicles, this big worldbuilding thing. They noticed, “We got this kid who puts in ten times too much effort on the worldbuilding.” [Laughs]. So they thought of me for the cosmic stuff. They could not have known what a big deal Superman is to me. That’s the brass ring and Action Comics specifically. There’s this conventional wisdom at DC as far as sales, Batman will sell more than Detective Comics which will sell more than Superman which will sell more than Action Comics. Those are the books that you want to get on. I don’t give a shit about any of that stuff. Action Comics is the grandfather book that all the others come from. If I could tell meaningful story on that book and lay at the feet of the heroes that got me out of a rough childhood, that was everything I wanted.
When I got the call, I never felt any of the anxiety that I expected. I heard other people talk about, when they got their big shot, how they felt the pressure. I never felt it. I was raring to go. I had such a clear voice for Superman that I wanted everyone to hear. Whenever I see a book that doesn’t have that voice, there’s a part of me that says, “That’s fan-fiction. That’s not who Superman really is.” To be able to put him on the page and let people see him was unbelievably exciting. Not just exciting but important. Writing Superman carries a weight of responsibility in a way that no other book does. I try to put a lot of myself in every book and try to make every story one that matters deeply that could help someone. When you’re writing Superman, you are at its core writing a story about how best to be human and to treat each other. It’s an honor of a lifetime. As soon as I wrap up this Superman series, I’m content. It’s such a colossal honor to write one of the greatest heroes in all of fiction.
Taimur Dar: After hearing you say you have your own particular opinions about Superman, I have to ask your thoughts on the aforementioned James Gunn Superman movie.
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: It was beautifully done. I loved it. Superman is truth and justice, so I don’t want to give a BS answer. I’ll tell you the truth. [Laughs]. The Superman take in that film is not quite my take. I try to always show a Superman that shows us the way. The Superman in this movie struggled and sometimes he gets frustrated and doesn’t know what to do. He’s just like all the rest of us. That’s not really how I do it but it’s a take I can completely get behind because he’s such a purely good guy. Like Lois says in that movie, he thinks everyone is beautiful. He saves a squirrel and tries not to let a monster die. He’s just a beautiful person. He’s not scary. He’s purely there to help and it’s all over his face and in every word he speaks.
For me, and this is part of my generation, it’s gotta be Christopher Reeve. I put my Superman in darker circumstances. In those old movies, the bad guys were never really that threatening. Luthor and those guys had the derpy tuba music theme. The bumbling bad guys with the land schemes. It’s hard to replace that in my mind. I’m not writing Christopher Reeve in the book. I’m writing my little kid perception of Christopher Reeve.
I try to write him making decisions that I am not good enough to make. For example, Metallo tried to Superman’s children so Superman shows us a new level of power because he’s never needed it and obliterates him. Metallo is in pieces on the ground [and Superman] helps put him back together and offers to help his sister. He knows that Metallo was only there because his sister was being used as leverage. He goes, “You’re going to help me? I just tried to kill your kids.” Then Superman says, “Anybody would do the same thing.” Metallo replies, “I wouldn’t.” And then Superman says, “Not yet maybe, but someday.” He believes in us in way that I want to. There are people in the world that I regard as villains that I think are irredeemable. Superman understands that there are no villains and they were made the way they were through abuse or fear. I aspire to see a world where there are no villains. This Superman was not quite that. But the vibe was. It was a brighter world that was fun and exciting. There’s danger but hope too. It makes you want to be one of the good guys. We can nitpick all we like but I love the movie. I think James Gunn is crushing it and I can’t wait to see the other movies that he does.
Taimur Dar: Though most people associate you with DC, you’re stranger to Marvel. In fact, you recently signed a Marvel exclusive. Whenever a creators goes exclusive with a publisher after a long tenure at another, there’s a temptation to assume potential friction. I’m fairly certain there wasn’t any drama behind-the-scenes, but how did the decision to sign this exclusive with Marvel come about?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: Not at all. Again, comics is about making cool stuff with your friends. I’ve got nothing but friends at DC and Marvel still. I’ve had these conversations with DC and Marvel both in the past but have been reluctant to take a deal like that for that reason. I don’t want to close any doors even if I’m making less money. This time it was different because I’m coming up at the end of my Superman run. I’ve already got one omnibus. Adventures of Superman: Book of El is going to be the capstone to my second omnibus. I’ve been unusually fortunate that way. I’ve written a ton of Superman. At this point, I’ve written forty pounds of Superman. That’s more than anybody gets. I had a good healthy run on Batman & Robin too. I’d love to do more but there was an end of an arc coming up. The timing for once was actually pretty good as long as they let me finish my current projects which they totally did. I just needed to carve out some creator-owned projects and they gave me those too. They’re giving me projects that I really want to do. The projects we talked about doing at Marvel are unbelievably exciting. I cannot wait for you to see what we’re doing. Everything made sense this time and the deal was a really good one. I have a son to think about too.
Also, the deal is not forever. Whenever I’m in talks about my DC time in finite terms it tweaks my ear a little. It’s not really over. [Marvel is] just buying my time. Then that time will come to an end and then we’ll talk again if we want to do another contract in a similar vein or if it’s time to open up and go back. I still have plenty more stories I want to do at DC and I still have a ton of friends over there. Right now, the exciting place for me as far as the stories I have yet to tell are at Marvel. I think I’ve gotten much bigger swings at DC up at until this point. The swing we’re taking on Hulk at the moment is my biggest swing ever. To include Fellspyre Chronicles and “Warworld Saga” in Action Comics, what we’re doing on Hulk is the biggest and most ambitious thing I’ve ever done. It’s massive. And I’ve got another big thing lined up after that. After this next chapter is done, we’ll see what’s next.
Taimur Dar: What Marvel characters speak to you as creator or are on your wish list to write?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: I think Spider-Man is an extremely powerful character. There’s not a clean analogue for Superman at Marvel. I think the closest thing to Superman that exists at Marvel is Uncle Ben as perceived by Spider-Man. He’s this guiding light that inspires him to be the best version of himself. As far as the guy illustrating absolute power but wielding with absolute humility, there’s not quite somebody like that. I think the closest thing might be Spider-Man but he’s always the underdog. But he’s also got that jokey tone that I don’t usually put in my books. It doesn’t mean that I can’t, I just haven’t.
I was at a dinner after a signing at a store and somebody asked me, “Do you want to write Spider-Man?” And I was like, “Nah.” I hadn’t thought about it. But then I started talking about my thoughts on Spider-Man. I was talking about the core of Spider-Man’s character is “can’t but must.” He doesn’t have what it takes but finds a way to do it anyway. Another element is finding ways in the story for Spider-Man to win even while Peter Parker loses. There’s always this cost to his personal life when Spider-Man wins. These elements I thought had been missing. I kept talking about it and got the light of Jesus in my eyes. I started to think I would like to write Spider-Man one day.
I have strong feelings about Wolverine as well. He’s been done so many different ways. We’ve seen the feral animal take. Sometimes we’ve seen him as the samurai trying to get it all together. Other times he’s all about the X-Men. I think there’s an opportunity for Wolverine to show him as a real male fantasy. Not in a toxic way, but as this unkillable badass that’s going to live forever who’s seen it all. There’s something about him that’s really compelling that I think would make a special book. I have a take on Daredevil I’d like to do that’s all about faith and the danger of hero worship. My passion project right now is Hellhunters which is my Marvel Inglorious Basterds book and my “Nazi therapy.” [Laughs].
Taimur Dar: Finally, any current or upcoming projects you want to plug for our readers?
Phillip Kennedy Johnson: Batman & Robin we’re in this arc called “The Quiet Man” that gets into this showdown with Scarface that I’m proud of that’s running through February. Adventures of Superman: Book of El runs through August. That’s the end of my Superman run for the foreseeable future. I’m doing a miniseries at Marvel called Dungeons of Doom which is like a Tales from the Crypt horror anthology set in Marvel. And of course Infernal Hulk just got rolling. It’s the second act to our Incredible Hulk story which builds up to something crazy. Be on board for that. There’s big stuff that’s coming and you don’t want to miss out on any issues. Make sure you jump onto Infernal Hulk while you can still get copies. And a big announcement midway through the way.
