How much does it cost to bring Neil Gaiman to your library these days? According to this piece, about $45,000. The Stillwater, MN library paid that much for Gaiman to come and kick off their Club Book author appearance series. The fee covered a four-hour appearance, but still caused some local grousing, since it was a third of the entire budget for the nine-author series.
Money for Club Book, a metrowide program started to expose suburbia to authors of critical national acclaim, comes from the state arts and cultural Legacy Fund. The money is raised through a 2008 voter-approved increase in the general sales and use tax.
Librarians defend Gaiman’s handsome sum as a rare opportunity to begin an outstanding series of author appearances that residents can attend without paying at the door. The event drew 500 people.
Library officials say the money came from a budget item that could only be use for library programming so it couldn’t be shifted to, say, buy books or staffing.
To put this into perspective, this amount of money for a figure of Gaiman’s stature (bestselling award-winning author) is well within the range of speaking fees. Politicians would top the list, with ex Pres. Clinton’s $450,000 fee or ex-Gov Sarah Palin’s $100K being typical of such world-spanning figures.
The article has a 100+ comment thread which reveals that a lot of angry taxpayers have not heard of Neil Gaiman. Perhaps a reading of American Gods during the “one Book, ONe Twitter” program will assuage their outrage somewhat.
He certainly doesn’t come cheap. He spoke at Temple University a few years ago while I was working in English Department on a work study job. The head of our department told me that after the speaking engagement he went out with a few professors and ended up billing the English Department for $400 bucks on sushi and alcohol.
(frankly I was jealous)
“To put this into perspective, this amount of money for a figure of Gaiman’s stature (bestselling award-winning author) is well within the range of speaking fees. Politicians would top the list, with ex Pres. Clinton’s $450,000 fee or ex-Gov Sarah Palin’s $100K being typical of such world-spanning figures. ”
Comparing a fantasy writers’s appearance at a public library to appearances by two prominent political figures, one an ex president, one or more whose appearances are likely funded by political lobbying groups, to provide “perspective” is just ridiculous.
Hey, he was clear what his fee was. They could have easily said no thanks.
Good for neil!
500 people is a great turnout for any library event. Of course, is it worth what comes out to $90.00 a head is also a pretty valid question.
Certainly anyone who follows Gaiman knows his schedule’s very busy, and he’s certainly entitled to be compensated for his efforts, but for a guy who’s spent a greater part of the last year doing library promotion (very much appreciated), it does seem a bit excessive to charge a year’s wages for a 4 hour appearance.
Not sure what to think of this.
This was also probably arranged through HarperCollins, as most larger publishers have speaking coordinators who work to place the publishers authors at events such as this, helping to make the arrangements and coordinate the logistics, thus the publisher also takes a cut of that fee.
And honestly, I think that much money is FAR better spent on listening to someone like Neil than Palin. The former will entertain, enliven, enlighten, and quite probably inspire the entire audience, the latter can only make you want to stab your brain with a letter opener.
You can buy a whole lot of books for $45,000. I’m just saying.
He just made more in four hours than I do in a year. Yeah, I’m just really jealous…
So what are the odds of Neil Gaiman doing a signing at your LCS? Ouch.
the Tiki
When he was here in Indianapolis the Wed before C2E2 for the Indianapolis Public Library, they held the event at a local high school that drew over 1400 people, packed the gym where he did his thing. And they had to turn people away. It was a huge success for the IPL…
>> You can buy a whole lot of books for $45,000. I’m just saying.>>
You sure can, but not with that money. The article notes that it’s specifically part of the speakers budget and can’t be used on books or staffing.
>> So what are the odds of Neil Gaiman doing a signing at your LCS? >>
Low. But then, the odds are pretty low for any writer. Neil signs at comics shops now and then (at Comix Experience in San Francisco recently) and they’re not paying that kind of fee (if any), but then, those signings are done out of friendship more than anything else, I’d say.
If he charged a lot less, a lot more places could afford him, and maybe he’d make a great living doing signings all the time, but we wouldn’t get as many novels and movies and such. It’s not just the cost of taking him away from home and hearth, but away from other work.
I’m glad his fees are high; I like it when he stays home and works, because I like the results.
kdb
Yeah, one can buy a whole lot of books with $45,000, but that money cannot be used to buy books or keep the lights on.
http://www.startribune.com/entertainment/books/89649937.html?page=1&c=y
“Minnesota voters approved the establishment of the Legacy Fund in 2008 and began paying for it July 1, 2009. The fund, which is covered by an increase in the general sales and use tax of three-eighths of one percentage point, will generate more than $200 million this year, to be spent on the outdoors, clean water, the arts, and parks and trails.”
The regional library organization received $1.2 Million. The Club Book program was created to bring notable authors to areas of the state not normally served by author events.
Also, if you visit Mr. Gaiman’s blog, you can hear the event as it was recorded by Minnesota Public Radio. If you read his blog regularly, you know he does a lot of travelling. As a bestselling author, he could easily lock himself away and just write, yet he spends an enormous amount of time speaking to and meeting with fans.
“This was also probably arranged through HarperCollins, as most larger publishers have speaking coordinators who work to place the publishers authors at events such as this, helping to make the arrangements and coordinate the logistics, thus the publisher also takes a cut of that fee.”
Many larger publishers do indeed maintain speakers bureaus to coordinate speaking events for their authors, but a little Googling seems to indicate that Gaiman is represented by GTN (the Greater Talent Network) which I don’t think is associated with HarperCollins or any other conventional book publisher (although, of course, they have several authors in their roster.)
http://www.greatertalent.com/NeilGaiman
Also, public facilities often are rather strictly budgeted in terms how their funding is apportioned, and it sometimes results in some skewed activities, because often times if a school or library doesn’t use the entirety of a particular apportionment in a given year, they lose that unspent amount in following years (the budgeteer thinking goes that “since you didn’t use it you don’t need it”).
I remember calling authors in college to get them to come speak at our literary weekend. I didn’t try Neil then, but I’m guessing that even nine years ago he was above our $2,000 budget.
Perhaps all those angry taxpayers are whining because the library’s budget would have been better spent on appearances by either Sean Hannity or Glenn Beck – whom I’ve heard are both great writers of children storybook fiction.
~
Coat
$45K fee for an appearance? At a PUBLIC, budgets-being-cut, staff-being-laid-off in this economy Library??
Poul Anderson showed up in my HS Library FOR FREE, even bringing along his son-in-law Bear to our little reading group: I guess he didn’t need the extra money? (Not that my HS had any spare $s for it.) And Ray Bradbury has been visiting numerous CA PubLibs at no charge FOR DECADES, giving a talk and staying to sign for his fans: I suppose he didn’t need that cash, either.
Nor WANT? Wonder if Gaiman has a “no brown M&Ms” clause in his appearance rider?
Sorry to the complainers, but I call their BS.
“Library officials say the money came from a budget item that could only be use(sic) for library programming so it couldn’t be shifted to, say, buy books or staffing.”
So the Library, who COULD NOT use the money to buy books or staff, paid to bring an author popular with a wide age-range of readers, whose work covers several genres and many topics. An author whose appearance brought in 500 people to that library.
What’s wrong with that? Isn’t that the purpose of the fund-to
Is the money the issue?
“The fee covered a four-hour appearance… it was a third of the entire budget for the nine-author series.
While it may SEEM a great deal of money, the library’s budget has, STILL, $90K to bring in 8 more authors. This gets money into the hands of authors (who normally get paid only when they finish & sell their work) and brings attention to the library, during these hard fiscal times, to show the good that the library can do for a community and the literary arts brought to a local community.
I fail to see the problem.
From Neil’s site:
Q. How can I get Neil Gaiman to make an appearance at my school/convention/event?
A. Contact Lisa Bransdorf at the Greater Talent Network. Tell her you want Neil to appear somewhere. Have her tell you how much it costs. Have her say it again in case you misheard it the first time. Tell her you could get Bill Clinton for that money. Have her tell you that you couldn’t even get ten minutes of Bill Clinton for that money but it’s true, he’s not cheap.
On the other hand, I’m really busy, and I ought to be writing, so pricing appearances somewhere between ridiculously high and obscenely high helps to discourage most of the people who want me to come and talk to them. Which I could make a full time profession, if I didn’t say ‘no’ a lot.
Is this just for speaking? Or can you rent people out for other stuff?
Like how much to have Jimmy P. tuck me in at night and hold my hand until I fall asleep?
Name your price Jimmy. I might be coming into some money soon so I think we can work this out.
Yep, I heard this from people when he came to Las Vegas a couple of years ago. That’s a nice gig if you can get it considering I subsist off about 10k a year.
Mr. Gaiman, after a number of years working for less-than-stellar pay (as I am sure) can now bring in these kinds of largish fees to speak. Frankly, he’s a good deal cheaper than many that I have booked or worked with myself in many places, and frankly gives good value for the money. I an cheered by the thought that he is at a place where he can ask for and get fees of this nature for an appearance.
I don’t see in this short article if that was the total. If it was, then not bad. But many speakers ask for their fee and then specify in contract that the sponsor also pays transportation, housing and per diem casts as well. If so, this could increase the costs considerably. Since (IIRC) he currently resides in Minnesota, it’s not a long trip for him.
If Gaiman can get $45K fee for a personal appearance— more power to him! America being a Capitalist country/ a writer’s time IS his money/ got to get what CAN be got, etc. etc. etc.
And for all we know, Neil donated that $45K BACK to that Minnesota Library… or given a nice donation to CBLDF… or to the American Red Cross for the disaters in Haiti and Nashville… or just bought himself a brand new BMW. Whatever.
But I guess the days of SF writers such as Anderson and Bradbury (to name two; I also got to meet Ursula LeGuin at another local Public Libary, again for free) WILLINGLY meeting their public AT NO COST whatsoever, is a thing of the past?
Must be a generational-Writer thing: since Clinton and Palin can get X for their public appearances, then why can’t I — a writer who’s proven his market value, got throngs of fans, mobbed at everywhere I go — get Y? Get me my agent…
They overpaid.
he charges what he charges.
the soup is three dollars.
i will have the soup.
that will be three dollars.
what!?
—
also – that is an awesome photo of the neil.
Neil can charge whatever he wants. If they don’t want to pay for it then they shouldn’t.
Hmmm. I’m surprised he accepted that much, since he wrote about it as if he was doing it to promote libraries, not make a profit.
This reminds me of the Sandman Zero graphic novel that didn’t happen a couple years back because DC couldn’t pay him the million dollars he’d earn for a prose novel from HarperCollins. Disappointing, but he has his reasons.
He has every right to charge whatever he wants for an appearance, it sounds like his time is limited and if he’s going to take an even a day out of his schedule he should be compensated whatever he thinks that is worth.
On the other hand this is a public library with limited resouces so it would be a nice gesture if he reduced/waived his fee.
Oh, and if he charged that much for a library appearance how much are we, the British taxpayers, paying him for his Doctor Who episode?
“And for all we know, Neil donated that $45K BACK to that Minnesota Library… or given a nice donation to CBLDF… or to the American Red Cross for the disaters in Haiti and Nashville… or just bought himself a brand new BMW. Whatever.”
Actually, we know, as it’s covered in the second half of the article. “25 percent of what I get goes to a social/abuse charity, and the other 75 percent goes to an author/literature library related charity program.” If he just automatically gave it back to whoever is bringing it in, it wouldn’t have the intended effect of discouraging being hired.
Was paying Neil $90 per audience member the best use of tax money? Probably not. But is that’s Neil’s fault for charging what the market will bear? No. If your friend blows all his money on a Porsche instead of buying a Hyundai, you don’t blame the Porsche dealer for not charging Kia prices.
BTW, Gaiman’s full response is at http://www.libraryjournal.com/blog/1010000101/post/1620054162.html
I don’t know how much Neil actually wanted for that Sandman graphic novel, but his complaint was that he and DC were so far apart in price that there was no middle ground as they offered him the same price he’d been paid when he was writing Sandman 20 years ago.
How about some context? How does the $45K (if it’s verified), compare with other contemporary fantasy/speculative/best-selling authors?
Its a lot of money.
On the other hand its not when you consider that NG has probably been writing professionally for close to 30 years, many of them probably not bringing home as much as he would if he’d held a regular job with benefits, etc. My guess is also programs pr bono, so, to me, for both those reasons, it pretty much evens out.
Doing a quick search for some best-selling authors – Dave Barry asks $28,750, Bob Woodward gets $35-$40,000, Ken Blanchard gets $70-$90,000, Mitch Albom for $35,500, Deepak Chopra for $75,000.
In the second half of the comments, the part of Kurt Busiek will be played by Nat Gertler.
Neil’s key public characteristic, the one that bonds his fans to him, is his graceful niceness. And through this comment string, this appearance price tag transgression has been defused.
That the $45K goes into charitable efforts absolves Neil of the Greed sin. And as demonstrated by his appearance at Comix Experience, this requirement is not iron-clad. But there’s still something ugly in the light here, and probably completely unintentional :
“(P)ricing appearances somewhere between ridiculously high and obscenely high helps to discourage most of the people who want me to come and talk to them”.
The mechanism of this tactic is granting primacy to wealth rather than desire. Some Wealthy Person who read a positive review of Coraline The Broadway Musical can get Neil for her kid’s Birthday party. Some Goth girl living on a minumum wage who has everything Neil’s ever done, including cover blurbs on other people’s work, but can’t pay her rent, doesn’t get Neil.
News Headline:
“Caught! ‘I Needed Money For Gay Man’ The Convenience Store Killer Confesses!”
#1 new website for porn fans :
“Hot Goth Girls Who’ll Do Anything For $45K Cash”.
With this point of view, I think it would be much more Neil-nice and Neil-graceful if he employed a different litmus test for appearance requests. Maybe such a change will come in the aftermath of this little PR blow-up…
Great comments thread guys. The main story seemed like the beginning of The Fall Of Gaiman, but your research and participation dispelled all that.
Nice web moment!
>> Some Wealthy Person who read a positive review of Coraline The Broadway Musical can get Neil for her kid’s Birthday party.>>
No, she can’t.
>> Some Goth girl living on a minumum wage who has everything Neil’s ever done, including cover blurbs on other people’s work, but can’t pay her rent, doesn’t get Neil.>>
Sure she can.
As Neil has noted, he turns down most of the requests he gets, so there’s little likelihood that he’s going to take birthday-party gigs just because there’s money attached.
And as Neil has also noted, most of the talks and appearances he does are done for free. So thousands of readers worldwide have had chances to see Neil speak, even people living on minimum wage.
>> With this point of view, I think it would be much more Neil-nice and Neil-graceful if he employed a different litmus test for appearance requests.>>
His litmus tests appear to be fine, since the scenaria you’re imagining don’t happen.
kdb
PS: Whoops! I was supposed to send that from the “Nat Gertler” account, wasn’t I? Sorry!
“25 percent of what I get goes to a social/abuse charity, and the other 75 percent goes to an author/literature library related charity program.”
Bravo for Neil! It’s heartening that the guy who came up with most approachable Grim Reaper personification EVER— created (with Pratchett) the wittiest eschatological farce this side of DOGMA— and envisioned America as worthy of the attention of Modern Gods— is not in it just for the filthy lucre!
Been a fan of his writing ever since his behind-the-scenes look into HITCH-HIKER’S GUIDE [my gateway into Gaiman-iana], and was pleasantly surprised when he turned to Comics writing… and beyond. (Am so proud of getting him and McKean sign that CORALINE “Diamond” edition: one of my most treasured possession.)
Still… it’s hard to accept that Neil charges THAT amount per Public appearance, having been exposed to counterexamples by other SF writers, who seemingly chose NOT to cash in their “market value” speaking fees.
Bravo and thanks to them/b>!
And the comments above rationalising and supporting the decision to ACCEPT such a fee boils down to me as something of a late ’90s cliche: Don’t hate the Playa, hate the Game. Funny, since I never saw Neil as the speaking Circuit equivalent of an OPP’ing
rapper! ;)
I’m glad that I’ve been able to meet, talk to, and get signatures from him way back when before the days of the $45K per appearance charge*… since it’s apparently more prohibitive for fans to do so nowadays.
But that’s just THE WAY THINGS ARE.
(* — minus the 15% commission slice of his representing Agency)
(And now off to see IRON MAN 2.)
Sorry for the screwy html’ing. :)
>> I’m glad that I’ve been able to meet, talk to, and get signatures from him way back when before the days of the $45K per appearance charge*… since it’s apparently more prohibitive for fans to do so nowadays.>>
You’re mistaken, Ed.
The fans who got stuff signed at that appearance didn’t have to pay to get in to the appearance or to get stuff signed. The fans who attended the other library appearance he did four days earlier did not have to pay to get in, or pay to get things signed. The library didn’t even have to pay for him to appear, at that one — as he noted, most of the appearances and talks he does are free.
So if you’re under the impression — as you say you are — that it’s “more prohibitive for fans” to attend Gaiman appearances and get stuff signed nowadays, it’s because you misunderstood the situation.
Neil probably meets and signs for more fans than I do, and I don’t have an appearance fee. The two things don’t correlate.
kdb
Whoops. Change that “probably” in the last line to “definitely.” If I have a line that lasts an hour at a con, it’s a busy show. If Neil has a line that lasts only an hour, it’s a short night.
Multiply that by the fact that Neil does many, many more appearances than I do, and yeah, more fans get to talk to or get stuff signed by Neil than by me by a couple of orders of magnitude or more.
kdb
And if that fan cannot afford to make it to one of Neil’s many appearances, he makes sure that presigned items are available at cover price, including items priced as low as $10. http://www.neilgaiman.net/signed.php?show=3
It doesn’t give you the thrill of working as a memento of the time you met him in person, of course.
(The original performer will be returning to the role of “Kurt Busiek” for the third half of this comment thread.)
It looks to me like most people aren’t going after Gaiman for this, but the people who made the decision to pay the fee in the first place. I have to say, paying that amount in taxpayer funds to give a thrill to 500 science fiction and comic book readers sounds pretty hard to justify to me. I don’t care if he’s “award-winning”. He writes entertainment pieces, some of which are more or less enjoyable. What did the library or the town receive for this of any lasting value? I’m not even sure why a nine-author library speaker series needs $125K to throw around in the first place.
Allen:
because.
That’s the.
Whole entire.
POINT.
Of the.
Program.
Darryl, which part is the whole. entire. point. of. the. program? Entertaining sci fi fans? I find it hard to justify entertaining people as a useful expenditure of taxpayer money. There’s plenty of ways for people to be entertained on their own dime. Cultural or historical significance, fine. Education, no problem. Giving a platform to art forms without a ready venue, I’m there. Spending thousands on bringing a best-selling author to amuse a crowd of fans – I just can’t see the lasting value. If you want to tell me why this is something that taxes should support, I’ll listen, but I don’t see it.
Kurt: I didn’t mean prohibitive as meaning “costly” ticket prices for fans wanting to meet Neil— I meant prohibitive as in “difficult” or “hard to do”.
As in: since Neil DOES charge $45K per appearance, it’s now less likely that a local, budget-limited Public Library or struggling Local Comic Shop could secure his presence at their place— thereby denying the fans THERE of the opportunity of meeting Neil. Best bet nowadays seem to be seeing him at a Convention,or live nearby an LCS that has an ‘in’ with him, or wait until a Publisher springs for a Tour that’ll bring
him to a bookstore nearby… as it had been before the $45K fee charge.
I guess I should be thankful for being fortunate enough to see Neil back then— for now, his ’superstar’ status have grown him a fandom that makes it, for the new Gaiman follower, a lot more difficult and a lot harder to stand in those looooong lines for him just to get a SANDMAN #8 or that ANGELS AND VISITATIONS signed. And yes: I did see him ‘without paying to get in or to get stuff signed’— just like those Minnesotans! (Well, minus a SDCC pass, comic book or novel bought at the sponsoring stores, that is.)
And the fact that Neil DOES opt to continue to meet his fans should be commended, $45K or no; and that he donates the income from that fee minus 15%(?)to charities, laudable.
Still… why $45K as the amount? If the goal is to discourage countless fans, organisations, LCS or PubLibs from calling him up to ask for an appearance— why not raise the asking price to a Palin-like $100K, if not the 10x Clintonesque $450K? Those amount will definitely make it prohibitive [there's that word again] for those groups to even call! That way, it’ll be even easier for Neil to continue writing in peace, unbeset by offers, and coming up with new works for his fans…
As it stands, that $45K amount seems like a calculated amount to winnow out those “smaller” fishes LIMITED in their budgets— and land the “larger” ones who are NOT: organisations and groups probably not your local Library or Comic Store. Great
for those who belong to those, not so great for those who don’t. As a fan, it leaves an aftertaste that’s hard to get rid off; nothing but a practise that reflects badly on those participate in it willingly.
Can you imagine how much $$s Ray Bradbury could’ve raised for his charities, if he’d charged his “market value” speaking fees??
(But who knows: perhaps in a couple of decades, in the autumn of his writing career, Neil will start giving those not-for-a-fee appearances at Libraries, LCS and High Schools everywhere to meet his adoring fans? All it’ll take is for “Morpheus” to whisper the idea in a dream… ;) )
>> since Neil DOES charge $45K per appearance, it’s now less likely that a local, budget-limited Public Library or struggling Local Comic Shop could secure his presence at their place— thereby denying the fans THERE of the opportunity of meeting Neil.>>
You’re just determined to overlook the fact that Neil does most of his appearances for free, right? That four days before the appearance you’re objecting to, he did another library appearance, for free?
He meets more fans, gratis, than I do. And yet, it’s prohibitive for his fans to meet him?
kdb
I agree with Ed’s points about using the price tag.
Ok- Neil does most of his appearances for free.
So then what is the role of this $45K price tag?
Does it only get applied to people he doesn’t like, in other words discriminatory pricing? Or does he employ a sliding-scale Socially-conscious ability-to-pay system? Why did one Library pay it when another got him free?
Mr. Busiek, your input on this thread has been invaluable. You’ve debunked what started as a sensationalist “can you believe this?” post.
But the money-thing remains. It may be something that can’t be resolved. Some of us folks don’t feel placing price-tags on things is good. Some of us folks are fine with price-tagging. As one of the former, I am not comfortable with this $45K figure being a part of the art/commerce life of a person I admire and think is “nice”. (Unless he uses the ability-to-pay sliding-scale with a Socialist conscience!). If you are the latter, you don’t really see why I should feel the way I do. And we both should just scratch our heads and move on.
Kurt: Pasting Mur Lafferty’s post above—
From Neil’s site:
Q. How can I get Neil Gaiman to make an appearance at my school/convention/event?
A. Contact Lisa Bransdorf at the Greater Talent Network. Tell her you want Neil to appear somewhere. Have her tell you how much it costs. Have her say it again in case you misheard it the first time. Tell her you could get Bill Clinton for that money. Have her tell you that you couldn’t even get ten minutes of Bill Clinton for that money but it’s true, he’s not cheap.
On the other hand, I’m really busy, and I ought to be writing, so pricing appearances somewhere between ridiculously high and obscenely high helps to discourage most of the people who want me to come and talk to them. Which I could make a full time profession, if I didn’t say ‘no’ a lot.
“Have her tell you how much it costs.” Thanks to the Star-Tribune’s reportage, and the Beat’s covering it here, that fee for Neil to show up at a school/convention/event is now known. So yes, “Neil DOES charge $45K per appearance”… So it’s just up to him whether to accept the fee. Or not?
I have no reason to doubt, as you state, that
“Neil does most of his appearances for free”: indeed, his tireless promotion on behalf of Libraries and reading programs throughout speaks volumes about the man. Once more: commendable, and laudbable.
But to find that sweet pricing spot between “ridiculously high” and “obscenely high” to “to discourage most of the people who want me to come and talk to them” is unsettling… esp. if you’re a fan of his who unfortunately patronise a PubLib or LCS easily ‘discouraged’ for financial reasons in calling up Greater Talent Network to ask for Neil. Maybe if they just knew that secret password that’ll get them past Lisa Bransdorf and talk to Neil himself, they
set up one of those many “appearances for free” that he does? There must be SOME mechanism in place, right? Maybe indeed some sort of “sliding scale” as Seth thinks— or maybe Neil just decides WHICH of his appearances he’ll do without charge…
So WHY even set that $45K fee then?
I know I’d rather keep saying “No” over and over again and be thought of being TOO busy and swamped for time to appear at a school/convention/event every time I’m asked
(a situation most fans can readily accept, AND understand)… instead of arbitrarily choosing a price point to do the job of narrowing down those appearances (as stated in the above FAQ)… and so risk being perceived in an unfavorable light (however mistaken it may be from a fan’s pov). But I’m NOT a well-known and prolific writer, so your mileage my vary…
Besides, I could never pull off that black shades/black jacket/black shirt “look” anyways. And I LOVE brown M&Ms.
$45,000!!!??? OMG!!!!??? These creative chappies out earning wheelbarrows full of money when they should be stuck in their dank little rooms sweating over typewriters and drawing boards.
It’s a disgrace that they even get paid for their work. I mean it’s hackneyed at best and derivative at worst. I mean, I don’t even know why we buy their crap, build them up into superstars and then have to pay thousands just to get them to do a public appearance.
String ‘em up! That’s what I say…and don’t get me started on about that Palmiotti guy!
Ed, this is stupid. Your complaint was that it was prohibitive for fans to see Neil, even though he does more appearances, most of them for free, than he did back in the days you found it non-prohibitive.
So now you’ve switched over to tut-tutting about the fee and arguing that it should be higher or nonexistent or there should be a protocol for making decisions that should be explained to you so you can pass judgment on whether it’s acceptable to you. Which kind of boils down to, you’re determined to disapprove of something, and you want to insist that Neil should do things the way you imagine you’d do them in his shoes.
If you’d rather keep saying no over and over again, that’d be your choice. Neil’s picked a different approach, one that results in him doing lots of appearances, meeting lots of fans, and generating large amounts of money for charities Neil would like to support. So be it.
Incidentally, Neil has addressed the flap in his latest blog entry. And anyone who actually wants to hear the talk he gave can find it, recorded and rebroadcast by Minnesota Public Radio, at:
http://minnesota.publicradio.org/display/web/2010/04/27/midday2/
kdb
Neil said last year, quite correctly, that “George R.R. Martin is not your bitch.”
I’m fairly confident the same applies to Neil.
I am a Neil Gaiman look-alike(also Elvis and Michael) and I will do appearances a lot cheaper, in the high double figures.
Kurt: If comics-blog chatter can spend pages and pages of commentary about the latest costume changes to an established MARVEL/DC character… or the latest ret-con editorial revisionism of those characters… then why not this? And should a topic arise that can provide some sort of insight into an admired writer’s philosophy and reasoning, all the better; and even better yet to have ANOTHER admired writer speak up on his defense. So no, I don’t think this discussion is “stupid” at all.
It was occasioned by the Beat’s simple reporting of Neil’s fee for a Minnesota Library appearance: $45K. Finding out that he donates the amount to various charities, however mitigating and commendable, in my opinion is not germane to what’s being discussed. Yes, he DOES charge that amount: it was there on his Contacts page on the website. And YES, he also makes appearances for Free, without charge; but this doesn’t absolve the intention of that fee as being there to “discourage” groups and organisations from asking him to appear at their events. (Hence my concern for Neil’s fans at ’smaller’ stores who can’t afford that fee.)
I don’t think I’ve misrepresented any of the FACTS of this situation… but I completely admit that the inferences and conclusions reached are MINE.
Having been fortunate enough to meet a couple of writers I’ve admired at events that they decided (afaik) to give without charging fees, I’m struck at how this practise of “market value” speaking rates can be so easily rationalised, if not justified. But for me, this has NEVER been the issue of whether of not Could Neil charge that $45K [since apparently he DID]—
But whether or not he SHOULD. In that regards, I’m thankful to have the counter-examples of Anderson, Bear, Bradbury and Le Guin (among others), to have in mind.
And thank you for providing a a staunch defense of Neil. Yours in e-discourse, ed.
Ever get the feeling you’ve been cheated?
“And YES, he also makes appearances for Free, without charge; but this doesn’t absolve the intention of that fee as being there to “discourage” groups and organisations from asking him to appear at their events. (Hence my concern for Neil’s fans at ’smaller’ stores who can’t afford that fee.)”
I think you may be misunderstanding the volume and source of most of the requests to speak that someone like Mr. Gaiman receives.
In the course of my work as a personal assistant it became clear to me that the bulk of the groups who wanted my employer to speak at their functions were large corporations and organizations looking for a private show. A perk for their employees/alumni/membership/supporters. We’re talking car companies to political parties.
These are the groups that I believe Mr. Gaiman is trying to discourage with his fee.
Visits to stores, large or small, are more likely to occur during a promotional tour for a publication. These tours would be arranged by and funded by his publisher. The fact that Mr. Gaiman’s book tours seldom include smaller stores is a logistics issue. If his schedule (and agreements with the publisher) allow him to be on the road for X number of days, the publisher will be trying to maximize the number of people he can see, and be assured that the spaces he will be in can accommodate the kind of traffic he pulls in.
He seems to be aware of, and concerned by the fact that his stature has risen to the point of making it difficult for smaller stores to be fit into his tours. Last year, at his request Harper Collins sponsored a Graveyard Book themed contest for independent bookstores with the prize being an appearance and signing at their location. Two winners were ultimately chosen.
This full-price library appearance incident seems to be an exception to the general rule, whereby libraries and similar organizations (the kind of places Mr. Gaiman believes he should be speaking, as opposed to say a shareholders meeting) get greatly reduced rates. This library didn’t get reduced rates because they didn’t ask for them. They have a great deal of money to get through by June, and probably only have staff to deal with so many events. Having one or two that soak up more of the fund (especially if getting the same amount next year is contingent on spending it this year) may have seemed like a good idea until the numbers went public.
Really, the problem here seems to be the fact that the library couldn’t roll the leftover funds over, and instead were forced into a mad author shopping spree.
>> But for me, this has NEVER been the issue of whether of not Could Neil charge that $45K [since apparently he DID]— But whether or not he SHOULD. In that regards, I’m thankful to have the counter-examples of Anderson, Bear, Bradbury and Le Guin (among others), to have in mind.>>
And yet, Neil does so many appearances for free that it’s still probably less “prohibitive” (to use the word you were focused on before you switched to complaining about him charging money for a minority of his appearances) to see him than any of them.
You’re still arguing that Neil should do things the way you imagine you’d do them in his position, regardless of the fact that your arguments don’t make sense, and you continually have to ignore facts to try to make these nonsensical points. You keep arguing that Neil won’t appear at smaller stores who can’t afford his fee, despite being repeatedly told that Neil does most of his appearances for free, including many places that can’t afford such a fee.
When it’s pointed out that you’re overlooking this, you promptly overlook it again, declaring that he charges the fee because it’s there on his website, and proceed to act as if he charges it for all appearances, despite being repeatedly told that he doesn’t.
If you’re going to make nonsensical arguments that only recognize the facts you care to recognize and ignore the ones that undercut that argument, then yes, the discussion’s stupid. Because you’re not actually engaging with reality, but rather an imaginary construct built out of ignoring all the bits of reality that disturb your argument.
Just to be clear: Ursula Le Guin is represented for speaking by the Lyceum Agency – http://www.lyceumagency.com/ursula+k_+le+guin.aspx
Greg Bear is represented by Random House Speakers Bureau: http://www.rhspeakers.com/speaker.php?sid=104&sna=Greg+Bear
Ray Bradbury is repped by Total Access Speakers Bureau: http://totalaccessspeaker.com/caas_display.php?speaker_id=283
In other words, yes, those folks too also offer to exercise their speaking talents for money.
(Poul Anderson is, these days, represented by Orson Scott Cards agency, Speaker Agents For The Dead. Rates available upon inquest.)
Okay.
Nat: Good thing I saw them back then, then? Would you happen to know of the rates they charge NOWADAYS… to provide a context for Neil’s decided-cost of $45K? Wonder if two LeGuins = Gaiman, or could you get a Bear and a Bradbury instead? Or could a ‘Palin’ get all four? And could Card bundle Anderson in a “Superstars of SF” Tour with Asimov, Clarke, PKD and Douglas Adams—cause I’d gladly pay a ‘Clinton’/10x Gaiman for that! (Maybe they can sign my Kindle downloads?)
Joanne: A reading of that FAQ section seems to indicate that that ‘between ridiculously high and obscenely high’ fee amount is meant to discourage hopeful fans wanting to get Neil for their event/organisation… ALONG with those Institutional ‘deep pockets’ that you’re talking about. A local LCS or bookstore or Public Library, or car companies to political parties: they’re ALL subject to that asking price… which seems to me to be the POINT of having that $45K fee.
Kurt: I think I’ve typed out and commented as much as I care about this topic. Barring new revelations from Neil on how EXACTLY he determines whether or not to charge the fee for an appearance I know where I stand on its practise. And how I feel about its apparently-selective application. Ultimately, it boils down to this: if Neil’s “asking price” wasn’t out there in the first place, I wouldn’t have ended up criticising it here…
(Besides, if I do have your attention, I’d rather spend time discussing OTHER subjects than the above: the superhero tropes and comics history you played around with in creating the ASTRO CITY universe. Your research and discovery of serendipitous events in the writing of MARVELS. The one-degree-of-separation you have with UNDERSTANDING COMICS. Your role— and responsiblity— in providing the editorial
retconning that robbed the X-MEN mythos its “Bucky”, its “Uncle Ben”, its “Gwen”;which I gotta admit, I can nevernevernever fully forgive you for.)
Thank you for taking the time out of your schedule to repeatedly reply to my points. I look forward to reading new works from you…
I dread to think what the future will bring/
When we’re living in gangster time
“Nat: Good thing I saw them back then, then?”
I don’t see any reason to assume that their policy then was substantially different from their policy now, nor from Neil’s policy now.
It seems to me like the library’s choice of authors is the only thing that should be in question, here. Don’t get me wrong – I’m a big Gaiman fan myself, but if his prices are pretty standard, then the fault really lies with the library for selecting an author whose popularity put him out of their price range. It would be like if they had a budget to purchase 9 cars, and the first thing they did was spend a third of their budget to buy a Ferrari. Perhaps a better assessment of which speakers they could afford would have been prudent.
Neil Gaiman just donated another $500,000.00 to Scientology in 2010 through his business partner Mary Gaiman who received a “Gold Humanitarian Award” for contributing to Ideal Org, MN.
Neil Gaiman and Mary Gaiman are business partners in The Blank Corporation and are funneling millions of dollars into Scientology.
The Gaiman family also derive a 6 million dollar income annually from G&G vitamins founded by the now deceased David Gaiman. G&G Vitamins has a monopoly to sell the purification rundown worldwide.