It has nothing to do with artists or writers , it puts stress on all the people in this country from commies to tea-baggers. The financial system that has been created that rewards Bank Executives for destroying our economy is just what creates hassles for the teachers, firefighters, librarians, nurses and office workers. The income disparity between CEO’s and workers is ten or thirty time larger then in any other country. I just don’t get it why, do you side with the 1% instead of the rest of America?

Why shouldn’t the money from the sale of Marvel have gone to the Kirby estate? Cripes they could have thrown them, Gene Colan, Ditko, Don Heck and John Buscema a million each and it wouldn’t have made any difference to those board members lives. Why shouldn’t some of that money be spent in development of the art form, research and development to make them millions more?

That seems like justice to me and like the funny books I read when I was a kid. I’m just a nerd who read to many funny books as a kid, always have been, always will be.

And to Mark Engblom: Clearly you’re not a defeatist, nor a loser cartoonist/illustrator who’s technically not below the poverty line. And you’ve probably got a piece of ALL that mad money that’s floating around. If that’s the case, you mind passing a few dollars my way? I’d greatly appreciate it, and then I could leave my soul-sucking corporate gig [which by the way provides excellent health benefits to me and my partner] and REALLY focus on becoming that cartoonist/illustrator who isn’t a loser.

I never said a word about your art, only your sad concepts, some of which utilize other people’s design work, which I think bears repeating in a conversation about creative work, income, etc (imo you actually have solid cartooning chops, but that’s not what I was talking about).

I think slapping someone’s design or logo on a shirt and selling it is rotten behavior, I’d rather be joyless, as you say, than creatively and ethically bankrupt. I have a feeling the Comics Code isn’t public domain, but I may be, and certainly could be, wrong about that. Cutting and pasting is still the lowest form of creativity, if you even want to call it that, but obviously you need the crutches for your hustling endeavors.

Your ignorance is again borne out when you ask people like Mark Badger to stop whining and do something when he’s been discussing what he’s tried to do about “it” through his work, volunteering and organizing. Mark, Dean Haspiel, myself, are doing something about it by working for a living, how do you think we get by, going to conventions and crying until we sell art? Whining at publishers to give us work? Selling dopey, lazy-ass shirt designs on the side? Maybe you’d be more upset about certain archaic practices of the comic book industry if you were in the comic book industry, instead of leeching off of it as a professional fan.

As for your digs at me, sure, I’m not well-known, clearly, and my own work doesn’t sell in large numbers, especially since the 90’s, but I get around, I have my readers and clients and collaborators, fortunately. And I’m not, say, as obscure as…Mark Engblom, if you wanna take that tack. In my defense, I’ve been writing and designing animation for a hit kid’s show on Nick Jr, working for Mad Magazine and doing comics for Dark Horse and Bongo. I’ll take that over peddling your threadbare wares anyday.

Finally, I hope I do sell you a lot of shirts, pal. Use the money to buy some more hot ideas. How about the F.O.O.M logo on a shirt? Or a Star Trek quote?

Good night, sweet prince. Keep on keeping on.

See, that stuff you mentioned was more of that “making stuff people might want” thing I was talking about. I don’t do the “toil in obscurity making stuff nobody wants” thing. Plus, none of the stuff you saw was what I do for my day job, which is stuff geared toward the classroom and educational content….which, while I don’t own it, brings me as much joy and satisfaction as your lofty original created works might bring to you.

Because you’re clearly a joyful person.

See, I’m completely satisfied with the niche I occupy in the art/graphics biz without feeling the pressure to meet Evan Dorkin’s standards of lofty art…or moan about the sad lot of creative types and how I “deserve” some subjective amount of money that’s “floating around” out there somewhere (the grasp of economics is stunning).

See, I’ve been around whiney fellow-artists for decades, and it just never stops or gets better. The perpetually wounded “We’ve been SCREWED” supine position plays well with your fellow travelers, but how about actually doing something about it instead of bitching about it for another twenty years?

I also didn’t remember Mark beating up on me back then so badly. At least not that time (ha ha). I do remember Mark and Kyle pointing out a lot of things that were amateurish and inept in my work at the time, and that those tips helped me a lot in getting my work in better shape.

First of all, nobody is saying they should be given money for the sake of their being an “artist”. There is an imbalance is what creators make and what is made off their creations, which is finally, albeit slowly, being dealt with as this immature, ass-backwards content-providing industry grows up a little bit.

Secondly, you might not understand the idea of actually creating something from whole cloth, because going by your website, you do nothing but stale superhero and superhero fan “gag” cartoons already done to death, exploit fan and pop culture phrases, and draw Marvel and DC characters created by others. Part of your own incredible work ethic — part of “your” “service”, some of “your” “products” involves slapping something designed by someone else and selling it on a t-shirt — The Marvel “Still only 25 cents!” bullet and The Comics Code Authority emblem, for two examples. Oh, and The X-Ray Specs design, for a third example of “your” work. Or your Justice Leagie logo parody t-shirt which I guess one can argue you “created”, but like everything else on your site, it’s based on something else, or references another person’s work or a phrase floating in the pop culture air. You’re a grabber and a user, you need to crow about self-promotion, hard work, and hustling, because you can’t crow about creativity, originality, skill or imagination. You’re a hustler, all right, a third rate one at that, a small-time flea-market curtain-jerker blowhard who grabs at the crumbs dropped by others who did the work before you. You’re a bottom-feeder, and the only thing sadder and more irritating than a bottom-feeder is a ignorant bottom-feeder with a smug attitude.

Look, I don’t care about your politics, I care about the junk you spewed here towards people I like and admire, who actually make comics and create things and have had to deal with some really negative garbage towards that end. You are ignorant about some of the things being discussed here because you don’t know much about Badger’s history and what he’s created that he arguably was not compensated for. Maybe if you ever actually created something original you’d understand what can happen in this business to actually creative people. No one’s playing the violin for themselves here, no one’s asking for things they don’t deserve. And the collective isn’t beating up on you here because the commies are out to get you, it’s because you are coming off as a prize jerk.

It’s a terrible time in the economy for just about every level — unless you are a Wall Streeters who got us here in the first place.

Based on the art appearing with this interview, it’s obvious that Mark Badger is an artist with gifts who deserves some compensation for his work. But given his health issues the only way he can even continue to do art is by having a wife with a job to pay for the drugs he needs. I don’t really see Mark whining about this situation so much as calling it like it is.

And a word to everyone: I’m proud of the lively comment section here at the Beat and while most of my posters seem to have liberal tendencies, I’m happy that folks who go the other way feel comfortable enough to post here and give the other side. So let’s all take a deep breath and step back and try to have a conversation and remember what brought us all here in the first place.

So… Engblom, instead of stating your gripes with a reasonable back & forth in mind, you start off being hostile, rude and offensive… then you feel ganged up on when a few folks disagree with you? It’s hard to take your points seriously when they’re littered with sloganeering (no one uses the word “collectivism” anymore with a straight face). If you actually read the interview, you’d notice that none of us said anything begrudgingly about any other artist in terms of the money they make, we were talking about the corporate structure. If a cartoonist isn’t working for Marvel or DC, they’re probably don’t make a lot of money for the work they do, so don’t confuse us being open abut our situation as begging for a handout.

Who deserves money? WE do, artists do, the minds and talents that create the intellectual properties that outlive their respective creators and make millions for those who’ve never even read a comic book. Oh, you mean a person should be compensated for what they produce accordingly? NO SHIT. Thanks for the lesson in the Way Things Should Work. While you’re at it, teach that lesson to the artists that toil to entertain you for year and get scraps in return like the Shusters or the Siegels, John Ostrander, Bill Loebs, Ed Hannigan, Dave Cockrum… tell it to the Kirby Estate, and try not to be as pompously condescending when you do so.