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	<title>Comments on: JMS: One more response</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/</link>
	<description>The News Blog of Comics Culture</description>
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		<title>By: V. Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30245</link>
		<dc:creator>V. Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 13:46:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30245</guid>
		<description>Exactly JMS, exactly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly JMS, exactly.</p>
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		<title>By: Unpopular</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30244</link>
		<dc:creator>Unpopular</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 13:37:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30244</guid>
		<description>Hmm, editorial mandates at Marvel making the actual writers of the books unhappy?

Meet the new boss; same as the old boss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, editorial mandates at Marvel making the actual writers of the books unhappy?</p>
<p>Meet the new boss; same as the old boss.</p>
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		<title>By: Torsten Adair</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30243</link>
		<dc:creator>Torsten Adair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 07:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30243</guid>
		<description>I read part four of OMD.  I&#039;ll read the first issue of the next arc. I might read the trades.  What I will do is buy the hardcover collections of JMS&#039; spider-man titles.
The possibilities of JMS&#039; outline ...make it perfect, then slowly let Peter know just how awful such a life is...  could have sustained years of storytelling.  Meanwhile, you pull a Secret Wars technique, where the next issue shows Peter, May, and Mary Jane back to normal, leaving readers to wonder what happened in between.  Heck, if that alternate line works, then they do the same for other titles, like Marvel did for Zombies or House of M. Maybe Bruce Banner can control his change into the Hulk, or Betty gains gamma abilities.  Or Sue Storm doesn&#039;t lose the baby.  Or Doctor Doom succeeds at Empire State. Or various deaths are reversed. Each year is an event, running complete and parallel to the 616 universe. Or let it continue as long as sales and stories allow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I read part four of OMD.  I&#8217;ll read the first issue of the next arc. I might read the trades.  What I will do is buy the hardcover collections of JMS&#8217; spider-man titles.<br />
The possibilities of JMS&#8217; outline &#8230;make it perfect, then slowly let Peter know just how awful such a life is&#8230;  could have sustained years of storytelling.  Meanwhile, you pull a Secret Wars technique, where the next issue shows Peter, May, and Mary Jane back to normal, leaving readers to wonder what happened in between.  Heck, if that alternate line works, then they do the same for other titles, like Marvel did for Zombies or House of M. Maybe Bruce Banner can control his change into the Hulk, or Betty gains gamma abilities.  Or Sue Storm doesn&#8217;t lose the baby.  Or Doctor Doom succeeds at Empire State. Or various deaths are reversed. Each year is an event, running complete and parallel to the 616 universe. Or let it continue as long as sales and stories allow.</p>
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		<title>By: Ceaser</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30242</link>
		<dc:creator>Ceaser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 16:42:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30242</guid>
		<description>Roman&#039;s comment is really interesting. If that is the case, OMD was a really really smart (but badly executed) step on Marvel&#039;s part. They&#039;re not selling to the people reading Spiderman now! They&#039;re selling to Spider-Noobs! If that is the case, I advise doing self contained stories. Anyone who wants to pick up Spiderman is driven away, I&#039;m sure, by the confusion and convolution. I know I am.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roman&#8217;s comment is really interesting. If that is the case, OMD was a really really smart (but badly executed) step on Marvel&#8217;s part. They&#8217;re not selling to the people reading Spiderman now! They&#8217;re selling to Spider-Noobs! If that is the case, I advise doing self contained stories. Anyone who wants to pick up Spiderman is driven away, I&#8217;m sure, by the confusion and convolution. I know I am.</p>
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		<title>By: James Van Hise</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30241</link>
		<dc:creator>James Van Hise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 04:38:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30241</guid>
		<description>Bring back the good old days? You mean Steve Ditko is going to write and draw Spider-Man again? It&#039;s amazing how much of the Spider-Man universe is based on just those 41 issues (including the 2 annuals and Amazing Fantasy #15).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bring back the good old days? You mean Steve Ditko is going to write and draw Spider-Man again? It&#8217;s amazing how much of the Spider-Man universe is based on just those 41 issues (including the 2 annuals and Amazing Fantasy #15).</p>
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		<title>By: Roman Bednar</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30240</link>
		<dc:creator>Roman Bednar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jan 2008 01:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30240</guid>
		<description>A few years ago I moved from a big Telco with 35,000 employees, working in a division with 1500 people to a small IT company with 100 employees. I was looking at Marvels financials around that same time and was shocked to see that they had more in common with the tiny IT company that I was working in than the big Telco I had just left. Their publishing arm was actually generating less revenue than the family owned company I was working for.  I also read that Marvel had almost run out of money at the end of 2000 and people had talked about having the books published through another company. Marvel would have basically ceased to be.

Marvel makes money from toys, licensing, publishing and now making movies. They make a lot more money from licensing than publishing. A lot of their profit for 2007 ( a great year for them financially by the way) was supplied by toys and licensing for Spider-Man 3. There is no new Spider-Man movie on the horizon and the 3 Spidey books that Marvel produced prior to OMD only had one consistently good seller. One of the books actually sold about the same amount as the Aquaman book over at DC which is pathetic really given how bad that book turned out to be.

I understand that Marvel publishing needs to generate more money from the Spider-Man brand. I also understand that the Spider-Man books had little in common with the licensing and movies which depict a Peter Parker more in tune with the classic Lee/Diktko/Romita days. I have no problem getting to a new (old?) place with them but I don&#039;t want to be insulted along the way or told that something was done for a certain reason when I know that it was not. Marvel probably wants this book to do World War Hulk numbers 3 times a month. That means about 145,000 an issue in sales. To get there,  they need to keep the readers they have,   bring in new ones along the way and keep them there for the whole of 2008 to meet their overall revenue projections. Based on the terrible execution of OMD and the fallout from it,  I really wonder if that is possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few years ago I moved from a big Telco with 35,000 employees, working in a division with 1500 people to a small IT company with 100 employees. I was looking at Marvels financials around that same time and was shocked to see that they had more in common with the tiny IT company that I was working in than the big Telco I had just left. Their publishing arm was actually generating less revenue than the family owned company I was working for.  I also read that Marvel had almost run out of money at the end of 2000 and people had talked about having the books published through another company. Marvel would have basically ceased to be.</p>
<p>Marvel makes money from toys, licensing, publishing and now making movies. They make a lot more money from licensing than publishing. A lot of their profit for 2007 ( a great year for them financially by the way) was supplied by toys and licensing for Spider-Man 3. There is no new Spider-Man movie on the horizon and the 3 Spidey books that Marvel produced prior to OMD only had one consistently good seller. One of the books actually sold about the same amount as the Aquaman book over at DC which is pathetic really given how bad that book turned out to be.</p>
<p>I understand that Marvel publishing needs to generate more money from the Spider-Man brand. I also understand that the Spider-Man books had little in common with the licensing and movies which depict a Peter Parker more in tune with the classic Lee/Diktko/Romita days. I have no problem getting to a new (old?) place with them but I don&#8217;t want to be insulted along the way or told that something was done for a certain reason when I know that it was not. Marvel probably wants this book to do World War Hulk numbers 3 times a month. That means about 145,000 an issue in sales. To get there,  they need to keep the readers they have,   bring in new ones along the way and keep them there for the whole of 2008 to meet their overall revenue projections. Based on the terrible execution of OMD and the fallout from it,  I really wonder if that is possible.</p>
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		<title>By: MBunge</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30239</link>
		<dc:creator>MBunge</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 18:53:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30239</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s amusing that JMS thinks his anal-retentive fanboy retcon &quot;Mephisto changed this, which then changed that and that and that and that and that etc.) is really any better than JoeQ&#039;s &quot;It&#039;s magic&quot; retcon.  It&#039;s still a turd no matter how much you polish it.

Mike</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s amusing that JMS thinks his anal-retentive fanboy retcon &#8220;Mephisto changed this, which then changed that and that and that and that and that etc.) is really any better than JoeQ&#8217;s &#8220;It&#8217;s magic&#8221; retcon.  It&#8217;s still a turd no matter how much you polish it.</p>
<p>Mike</p>
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		<title>By: rich</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30238</link>
		<dc:creator>rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 18:50:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30238</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s a quote from CBR, also quoting Joe Q.

&quot;To Quesada, that solution discounted every issue of Amazing Spider-Man since that 1971 story arc, and by doing that, would have caused far-reaching and unmanageable changes throughout the larger Marvel Universe. &#039;In other words, there was just no way to tell Joe’s [JMS] story without blowing up the entire Marvel U and every Spider-Man fan’s collection,&#039; Quesada said.&quot;

Yeah, but ... this OMD invalidates twenty years worth of comics, anyway.  And, as I&#039;ve already pointed out ... the copy promoting the next issue sounds like a 1968 blurb.  Glad I don&#039;t buy Spider-Man anymore ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s a quote from CBR, also quoting Joe Q.</p>
<p>&#8220;To Quesada, that solution discounted every issue of Amazing Spider-Man since that 1971 story arc, and by doing that, would have caused far-reaching and unmanageable changes throughout the larger Marvel Universe. &#8216;In other words, there was just no way to tell Joe’s [JMS] story without blowing up the entire Marvel U and every Spider-Man fan’s collection,&#8217; Quesada said.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah, but &#8230; this OMD invalidates twenty years worth of comics, anyway.  And, as I&#8217;ve already pointed out &#8230; the copy promoting the next issue sounds like a 1968 blurb.  Glad I don&#8217;t buy Spider-Man anymore &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Green</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30237</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 18:39:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30237</guid>
		<description>Regarding Jonathan&#039;s questions...

1) does this mean that Gwen Stacy didn’t hump Norman Osborn?

According to JMS, yes. Probably the best thing to come out of this!

2) hell, is she still alive now?

Joe Q. admitted that he wanted to have her alive again, but was talked out of it. Thank GOD.

3) did the Clone Saga happen?

Yes, it still did. It&#039;s still missing from my Spidey collection, too, thankfully.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding Jonathan&#8217;s questions&#8230;</p>
<p>1) does this mean that Gwen Stacy didn’t hump Norman Osborn?</p>
<p>According to JMS, yes. Probably the best thing to come out of this!</p>
<p>2) hell, is she still alive now?</p>
<p>Joe Q. admitted that he wanted to have her alive again, but was talked out of it. Thank GOD.</p>
<p>3) did the Clone Saga happen?</p>
<p>Yes, it still did. It&#8217;s still missing from my Spidey collection, too, thankfully.</p>
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		<title>By: rich</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30236</link>
		<dc:creator>rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 17:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30236</guid>
		<description>&quot;To him superheroes are for old people and movies.&quot;

I can&#039;t understand the &quot;old fanboy&quot; crap.  If you don&#039;t like super-heroes, you don&#039;t like them.  Same with manga ... I&#039;m not interested in characters who all look female with big round eyes.  Knock yourself out, if that&#039;s your cup of tea.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;To him superheroes are for old people and movies.&#8221;</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t understand the &#8220;old fanboy&#8221; crap.  If you don&#8217;t like super-heroes, you don&#8217;t like them.  Same with manga &#8230; I&#8217;m not interested in characters who all look female with big round eyes.  Knock yourself out, if that&#8217;s your cup of tea.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30235</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 16:46:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30235</guid>
		<description>The future of comics is 1968!

Comic books are a medium where literally anything is possible, and yet Marvel would rather polish the nostalgia knob.  Even TC is &quot;excited&quot; to see comics going back to the 70&#039;s.

Back. Retro. Old-Fashioned. Yaay.

Anyone surprised that new readers aren&#039;t flocking to comics? Why do I want to read comics that are harkening back to a time a decade before I was born? My girlfriend&#039;s brother got into comics reading Hellboy, Goon and Sandman. To him superheroes are for old people and movies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The future of comics is 1968!</p>
<p>Comic books are a medium where literally anything is possible, and yet Marvel would rather polish the nostalgia knob.  Even TC is &#8220;excited&#8221; to see comics going back to the 70&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Back. Retro. Old-Fashioned. Yaay.</p>
<p>Anyone surprised that new readers aren&#8217;t flocking to comics? Why do I want to read comics that are harkening back to a time a decade before I was born? My girlfriend&#8217;s brother got into comics reading Hellboy, Goon and Sandman. To him superheroes are for old people and movies.</p>
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		<title>By: rich</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30234</link>
		<dc:creator>rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 16:35:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30234</guid>
		<description>I suppose the whole storyline is an attempt to rekindle &quot;the good old days,&quot; which I remember, but that doesn&#039;t necessarily mean this is a good idea.  Here&#039;s what seems to be a solicitation for Bright New Day:

&quot;AMAZING! AMAZING! AMAZING! This is it, Arachnophiles!!!! Prepare for what promises to be the most pulse-pounding piece of four color fiction to be delivered unto the Mighty Marvel Minions in decades! You asked for more Spidey! You demanded it! And, by Buckley, you&#039;re gonna get it! After the devastatingly heartwarming events of ONE MORE DAY, Peter Parker puts the past behind him and sets forth on a BRAND NEW DAY! Starting with Amazing Spider-Man 546, you now have THREE times the action! THREE times the villains! THREE times the danger! Amazing Spider-Man – Now 3 times every month! Bank on it, buck-o! And if that weren&#039;t enough: ASM 546 goes double-sized to bring you back-up features that introduce you to the new players in the lives of Peter and his family!    On-sale: January 9th 2008&quot;

That whole paragraph screams &quot;Stan&#039;s Soapbox&quot; or Bullpen Bulletins, circa 1968.  But then, why read an imitation when you can just pick up a Marvel Masterworks? This could be proof that every series should probably have an ending.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose the whole storyline is an attempt to rekindle &#8220;the good old days,&#8221; which I remember, but that doesn&#8217;t necessarily mean this is a good idea.  Here&#8217;s what seems to be a solicitation for Bright New Day:</p>
<p>&#8220;AMAZING! AMAZING! AMAZING! This is it, Arachnophiles!!!! Prepare for what promises to be the most pulse-pounding piece of four color fiction to be delivered unto the Mighty Marvel Minions in decades! You asked for more Spidey! You demanded it! And, by Buckley, you&#8217;re gonna get it! After the devastatingly heartwarming events of ONE MORE DAY, Peter Parker puts the past behind him and sets forth on a BRAND NEW DAY! Starting with Amazing Spider-Man 546, you now have THREE times the action! THREE times the villains! THREE times the danger! Amazing Spider-Man – Now 3 times every month! Bank on it, buck-o! And if that weren&#8217;t enough: ASM 546 goes double-sized to bring you back-up features that introduce you to the new players in the lives of Peter and his family!    On-sale: January 9th 2008&#8243;</p>
<p>That whole paragraph screams &#8220;Stan&#8217;s Soapbox&#8221; or Bullpen Bulletins, circa 1968.  But then, why read an imitation when you can just pick up a Marvel Masterworks? This could be proof that every series should probably have an ending.</p>
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		<title>By: TC</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30233</link>
		<dc:creator>TC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 16:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30233</guid>
		<description>to Fanboy Menace: I did pick a side -- stated at the beginning that I&#039;m for the undoing of the marriage and looking forward to BND.

And yeah, I might be guilty of getting worked up in my own post but the real point I was trying to make was the extremes some of these guys are taking -- the personal attacks on Joe Q and others involved, especially the name-calling and wishing of personal or professional harm.  It&#039;s really pathetic. That may make me sound like Dudley DoRight but that&#039;s how I feel.

Besides -- I think the fact that some of these guys have nothing better to do is post all day on message boards says it all. Whenever a big story like this breaks I scan a few to gauge the fan reaction -- and this one has been beyond the pale.

And with that, I&#039;m out suckers. Not going to get drawn into a war of words on the Beat. I have a day job to go to.

&#039;Nuff said.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to Fanboy Menace: I did pick a side &#8212; stated at the beginning that I&#8217;m for the undoing of the marriage and looking forward to BND.</p>
<p>And yeah, I might be guilty of getting worked up in my own post but the real point I was trying to make was the extremes some of these guys are taking &#8212; the personal attacks on Joe Q and others involved, especially the name-calling and wishing of personal or professional harm.  It&#8217;s really pathetic. That may make me sound like Dudley DoRight but that&#8217;s how I feel.</p>
<p>Besides &#8212; I think the fact that some of these guys have nothing better to do is post all day on message boards says it all. Whenever a big story like this breaks I scan a few to gauge the fan reaction &#8212; and this one has been beyond the pale.</p>
<p>And with that, I&#8217;m out suckers. Not going to get drawn into a war of words on the Beat. I have a day job to go to.</p>
<p>&#8216;Nuff said.</p>
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		<title>By: rich</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30232</link>
		<dc:creator>rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 15:35:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30232</guid>
		<description>&quot;Part of it must be pressure to make the comics “like the movies”, which is why the happy couple is no longer married and Harry Osborn is back.&quot;

I agree ... which makes this even more amusing &amp; confusing.  By the end of SPIDER-MAN 3, in movie continuity, it&#039;s apparent that MJ and Peter will eventually wed.  And Harry is dead.

So now the comics look LESS like the movies.  Again.  It&#039;s almost as though Marvel is TRYING to keep itself distant from the films.

(I don&#039;t know how I managed to rhyme like that above either)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Part of it must be pressure to make the comics “like the movies”, which is why the happy couple is no longer married and Harry Osborn is back.&#8221;</p>
<p>I agree &#8230; which makes this even more amusing &amp; confusing.  By the end of SPIDER-MAN 3, in movie continuity, it&#8217;s apparent that MJ and Peter will eventually wed.  And Harry is dead.</p>
<p>So now the comics look LESS like the movies.  Again.  It&#8217;s almost as though Marvel is TRYING to keep itself distant from the films.</p>
<p>(I don&#8217;t know how I managed to rhyme like that above either)</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30231</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jan 2008 14:35:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.comicsbeat.com/2008/01/03/jms-one-more-response/#comment-30231</guid>
		<description>I haven&#039;t been following this closely (because I have stopped buying comics, or rather collecting &quot;pamphlets&quot; as The Beat would refer to them), and while I&#039;m definitely not happy with the execution or the direction of this story, I was wondering if someone could inform me:

1) does this mean that Gwen Stacy didn&#039;t hump Norman Osborn?

2) hell, is she still alive now?

3) did the Clone Saga happen?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t been following this closely (because I have stopped buying comics, or rather collecting &#8220;pamphlets&#8221; as The Beat would refer to them), and while I&#8217;m definitely not happy with the execution or the direction of this story, I was wondering if someone could inform me:</p>
<p>1) does this mean that Gwen Stacy didn&#8217;t hump Norman Osborn?</p>
<p>2) hell, is she still alive now?</p>
<p>3) did the Clone Saga happen?</p>
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